Web programming tools (Dan Shafer)

[Sadhunathan Nadesan]

Mark,

I would agree with Dan.  However, I think the world's programming tools
have pretty much *not* caught up yet to what you want to do.  In my case
I want to do professional data base applications that run in a browser.

Earlier this year I posted to this list a (kinda hokey I admit) approach
to using MC (Rev should work too) as a CGI back end MC front end to a
Postgres data base.  Not exactly what you had in mind, but illustrates the
CGI principles using x-talk.  <I need to follow that up with a post about
SQL injection (which was the security hole in the sample ap I posted).>

Ok, but what about web browser based stuff?  Obviously people are
coding in Java to do it and a high level of skill is involved to set
up J2EE.  You could look at Jbuilder or the free IDE from Sun, Cafe I
think it's called?  Also LAMP is a way to go with IDE editors like PHPeD
from Nusphere, look elsewhere for the HTML design part.  The folks with
sufficient cash may be using IBM's websphere.

I have been searching for the right tool for almost a couple years now
and have yet to say 'bingo!'  In house we have developed some proprietary
technology with Java & C but holy cow it's very complicated.

The one tool I have found that I like the best .. closest to the MC
experience, ie, drag and drop to build your UI, right click to attach any
field to a data base, details of J2EE taken care of for you .. etc .. is
Unify Corp's NXj.  A bit pricey, about $5k per seat I believe.  Alas,
it doesn't run against open source data bases .. just the Oracle's, SQL
server, etc.  Plus, their ODBC or native drivers for these are licensed
per connection.  Ouch!  That doesn't work for me (at $200 a pop say,
if I have 100,000 potential customers, can't afford it!)  Darn.  But it
is a very good tool.  Might work for you if you can pass on the connect
fee to your clients.  Check www.unify.com

I am SO interested in hearing what other people think.  Even though
the browser is a lousy UI, the world has come to accept it, so, the
client is aways right, eh?  

Aloha,
Sadhu






| From: "Dan Shafer" <dan at eclecticity.com>
| Subject: Re: Web programming tools
| 
| Mark Lacy writes:
| 
| >What web programming tool or tools would you recommend for developing 
| >applications when delivery in a standard web browser is required?
| 
| A couple of quick answers, Mark. I, too, want to develop primarily Web-centric apps, sometimes in the browser and sometimes outside of it.
| 
| Over-simplifying, there are three basic approaches to Web app development. There's what's called LAMP (Linux, Apache, mySQL, and Perl/Python scripting). There's DHTML (combining HTML, JavaScript, XML...open standards technologies all). Finally, there's server-side approaches including ASP, JSP, Cold Fusion, and a few others. (I *think* MC has a CGI model; if so, you could perhaps stay with your favorite tool and still deliver in the browser. I use Revolution, not MC, so I can't be sure I'm right about this, but I am pretty sure Revolution has this capability.)
| 
| LAMP and server-side approaches require professional programming skills and, often, teams. To me, the only really viable single-programmer approach to browser-deployed solutions at the moment is DHTML. But there are major restrictions on the user interface UNLESS you are willing either to use Macromedia Flash for the UI (not a bad choice, even though it's proprietary) or to use Jython (Python written in Java) or JavaScript to tie into the Java Swing UI classes for your interface (also a good solution once you understand a few pitfalls for cross-platform deployment).
| 
| So I'd first look at MC and/or RR and see if their CGI capabilities will allow you to create your solutions in your favorite tool and deliver them in the browser. If so, you're home free. If not, check out DHTML combined with either Flash (and its ActionScript programming language, which is as accessible as JavaScript) or the Java UI componentry available through Jython and JavaScript.
| 
| HTH
|